Primera with ITBs

[G-man]

have currently got a Primera GT with a SR20VE, not many big mods on it yet, as the engine was only swapped about 12mths ago...have so far been spending time sorting out minor issues and makeing sure it runs fine as it is before going on the modding trail...

my goal has always been to stick some ITBs on the Primera which seemed a distant plan with the cost involved in the actual itbs let alone a standalone ecu..

but have recently found Martin Bruwer has made a ITB kit thats a straight fit for this engine...and at a affordable cost...so my next misson is to find a suitable standalone ecu hence coming on here....

this is how the car is at present...



some dyno figures before the car was properly mapped...






a vid of it on the dyno...

http://www.youtube.com/v/nuz-H066FdE

At the time the above RR was done, I was running with a stock SR16VE ecu with no tuning
HS gen 5 header, 2.25" tapered to 2" catback basically mods that were on the car for the DE...


since the above runs, I have got the factory ecu remapped here in the UK, was done on the road, ideally need to dyno tune it. and have also got more recently fitted a Fuji header...

plans are to get a better catback...2.5" or possibly a 3", stick some 16VE or N1 cams in there and when the ITB kit arrives to get that fitted...which cams and catback I go for will now also depend on whats best with the ITBs...

I can get my head around most of the mechanical working of the engine etc...but when it comes to ecu's wiring leccy system....have no clue whatsoever...lol...


am hoping to find out from here what would be the best VEMs system to go for my setup, where to buy and what kind of price...

fitting it, am still not sure whether I would be confident enough to attempt this myself...may have to get someone's help to get it installed....


the ITBs going in the car should be like this set, currently being installed on one of the guys in SA who has help develop the setup for this engine...

[irishtwincam]

Read PhatBobs experiences
http://www.vems.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=339.15

Im curious how your engine went from 150-180bhp?
Was it 150bhp with stock ecu, and 180bhp remapped?
Can you post your fuel / spark from the remapped stock ecu.
Also valve lift @ TDC if you can.

Can you also post more engine bay pics of your current setup.
Exhaust manifold, intake etc. Comrpession test figures.

Lots of data would be good

[G-man]

sorry my bad...should have explained a bit clearly re the dyno graphs above....the 149 is whp and the 180 bhp.....from the same run...

posted the two graphs as one shows the power curve etc and the other shows AFR...

I haven't had the car redynoed since having it mapped on the road....

cams are the factory standard that come with the VE...will get their specs up and post up some more pictures of the current engine bay over the weekend..

exhaust manifold is the Fuji one for the SR20VE...will find some specs of that and the intake manifold is again at present factory ....

[[email protected]]

That VE head and cam combination really looks awesome...  I keep wondering about the DE->VE Hybrid.
Apparently the heads arent easy to come by though.

[G-man]

here are the cam specs of the current setup..

SR20VE
Intake cam
Low lobe: 8.4mm lift @ 220 duration
Low lobe center angle: 110deg
High lobe:10.7mm lift @ 264 duration
High lobe center angle: 104deg

Exhaust cam
Low lobe: 6.6 mm lift @ 244 duration
Low lobe center angle: 122deg
High lobe:10.34 mm lift @ 268 duration
High lobe center angle: 114 deg

am looking at possibly getting SR16VE N1 cams or Franklin S4 Cams...(though there is a new set of cams being tested at present which are meant to be better than both the above) so may wait till those come into production...

specs for the N1

SR16VE N1
Intake cam
Low Intake Duration: 220
Low Intake Lift: 8.4
Low Intake Center Angle: 110

Low Lobe Center Angle: 116
Low Overlap: 0

High Intake Duration: 288
High Intake Lift: 12.0
High Intake Center Angle: 104

Exhaust cam
Low Exhaust Duration: 244
Low Exhaust Lift: 7.95
Low Exhaust Center Angle:122

High Exhaust Duration: 288
High Exhaust Lift: 11.9
High Exhaust Center Angle:110


Intake Low: Opens at 0deg before TDC, Closes at 40deg After BDC
Intake High: Opens at 40deg before TDC, Closes at 68deg After BDC
Exhaust Low: Opens at 64deg before BDC, Closes at 0deg After TDC
Exhaust High: Opens at 74deg before BDC, Closes at 34deg After TDC

[G-man]

That VE head and cam combination really looks awesome...  I keep wondering about the DE->VE Hybrid.
Apparently the heads arent easy to come by though.

would the VE head from the FWD engine fit yours.....if so am surprised ya haven't looked on sr20forums etc...seen quite a few VE heads up for sale on there...

[[email protected]]

When ever I looked I saw that the conversion was possible (one of the forums has a step-by-step guide which I have bookmarked at home - I'll dig it out tonight.) but that the heads were hard to come by. 

EDIT Here it is: http://www.sr20forum.com/sr20ve-sr16ve/162336-my-ve-head-swap-how-picture-heavy-roller-rocker.html
Its all still FWD but I understand that people have made them RWD.

The difficulty that most people seem to have with the FWD is converting the distributor to the RWD - that wouldn't be a problem for me as I'll use a crank trigger.

Got any links to available heads?

[irishtwincam]

So what cam specs aer in your DE head bob?
You ahrdly used DET cam timing instead of DE did you ;-D

[G-man]

When ever I looked I saw that the conversion was possible (one of the forums has a step-by-step guide which I have bookmarked at home - I'll dig it out tonight.) but that the heads were hard to come by. 

EDIT Here it is: http://www.sr20forum.com/sr20ve-sr16ve/162336-my-ve-head-swap-how-picture-heavy-roller-rocker.html
Its all still FWD but I understand that people have made them RWD.

The difficulty that most people seem to have with the FWD is converting the distributor to the RWD - that wouldn't be a problem for me as I'll use a crank trigger.

Got any links to available heads?

here is one for sale mate...  http://www.sr20-forum.com/showthread.php?t=10616

[[email protected]]

Something puts me off buying an unknown head from some bloke somewhere in the US.

[G-man]

lol aye, thats the only problem...suppose your only hope is to check out the sellar on there and check some of his/hers older posts and see how they treat their cars....

there have also been heads on there being sold by more of the established members, but they don't want to ship abroad...doh...

[G-man]

with going the way of Vems which features of the car do I loose having lost the use of the factory ecu?....I assume stuff like gauges etc are just a case of hooking onto the wiring into the Vems...would this be the same for the speedo, oddometer, revcounter etc....


I read on the thread ya linked to earlier in here that AC would be a problem....that'll be a bugger will have to see how or if I can get round that...
also looking at the dizzy and the disc on that thread...had a look at the spare dizzy I have sitting next to me, the disc in it is the same as the later one he got from another FWD mota...so looks like positive stuff on that front...

[Bat]

Hi,
Speed signal wouldn't got to the VEMs so you can leave that as "stand alone" Revcounter would be driven by VEMs there's a menu to set it up in the software.
AC would be better stand alone as well, although may require wiring/pressure switch mods dependant on how much control the factory ECU had over the AC.
Cheers,
Gavin

[[email protected]]

We need to work out what happens when the AC button is switched - in its simplest form all we need is a relay to activate the AC relay when the AC switch is pressed, and to connect the VEMS so that it can switch the AC off when the throttle goes over 95%.
There may be more functionality - like turning on the electric fan when the AC is on, but much of this can be replicated with relays and ECU control - we just need to figure out what it is.

[G-man]

Can you also post more engine bay pics of your current setup.
Exhaust manifold, intake etc. Comrpession test figures.

Lots of data would be good

the factory claimed CR of the engine is 11.1:1 (what it says in the manual basically) but a few guys over on sr20forum (ones who know what they are doing and you can fully trust) have tested this and have found the CR to be more to 10.3:1, this can be bumped to 12.5:1 by getting some 16VE pistons, shaving a 1mm off them and using them...

something I may well look at doing later on....first call for me is to get the ITBs and some standalone system (VEMS favorite at present) installed and running the car..