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General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: mads b (dk) on September 30, 2015, 11:23:05 am

Title: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: mads b (dk) on September 30, 2015, 11:23:05 am: I know that this is not what you normally want..... but how do I tune my rev. limit to get pops, bangs and flames :o

Im running sparkcut at 6000rpm, i have triede to retard ign to 0 degrees at 5700-6500 in ign map.
I have tried hard cut in settings.

Info vw type1 boxer engine 1600cc
Lambda when on rev limiter 0.72 (spark cut, control range 0, ign 0 degree )

Regards Mads
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: Kamuto on September 30, 2015, 02:24:18 pm: enable antilag on these rpm :D spark cut and retard depending tps position
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: mads b (dk) on September 30, 2015, 08:02:41 pm: Something like this
https://goo.gl/photos/iTCZBoLMThauTic17
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: Kamuto on September 30, 2015, 09:03:21 pm: Quote from: mads b (dk) on September 30, 2015, 08:02:41 pm
Something like this
https://goo.gl/photos/iTCZBoLMThauTic17
retard too big 50 max I think, and you need some % spark cut ;)
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: mads b (dk) on October 01, 2015, 08:46:31 am: Ok thanks....

What about all the TPS settings ?
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: Kamuto on October 01, 2015, 11:38:46 am: Quote from: mads b (dk) on October 01, 2015, 08:46:31 am
Ok thanks....

What about all the TPS settings ?

95-100 or something
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: smurfinator on October 02, 2015, 06:48:50 pm: I got sparks and flames when I used the ignition based idle control. Blew the guts right out of the catalytic converter.

It also sounded like a P-51 fighter plane, which was super cool. Even innocent bystanders would comment that it sounded like WW2 plane :P

But, yeah. The guts exploded out of the cat :]
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: e30sforlife on April 27, 2018, 10:00:40 pm: Quote from: mads b (dk) on September 30, 2015, 08:02:41 pm
Something like this
https://goo.gl/photos/iTCZBoLMThauTic17

Did you ever get this figured out? If so id love to see a video. Trying to do the same on my 2.8L BMW M52.
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: PaulsM on May 10, 2018, 03:35:13 pm: Just tried this on m52. I do not understand why it shows lambda 1.8 (extra lean), I tried to richen up on VE table on those exact places, where it "antilags", but still it shows lambda 1.8 or more.
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: Rak on May 11, 2018, 08:01:18 am: Wbo2 reads missfire(unburned fuel) as lean.
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: gunni on May 17, 2018, 03:32:17 pm: Quote from: PaulsM on May 10, 2018, 03:35:13 pm
Just tried this on m52. I do not understand why it shows lambda 1.8 (extra lean), I tried to richen up on VE table on those exact places, where it "antilags", but still it shows lambda 1.8 or more.

don´t chase ANY lambda values during antilag they are a mixture of burned and unburned combustion so you can´t tell what is the lambda for the normal combustion periods.
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: Mac-B on January 18, 2020, 07:51:46 am: I'd like to warmup this old one....
A lot of modern sport cars do misfire? backfire popping noises while off throttle in sport mode.
What are the settings to get the same behaviour for the big show 8) ?
Optional with \ without flames ?
Cheers,
Marcus
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: gunni on January 18, 2020, 06:57:27 pm: Basically you need to activate antilag either always or for pop and bang shows.
Then open the idle control valve all the way, set ignition retard and no fuel cut and see what happens
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: Mac-B on January 19, 2020, 06:52:37 pm: Can you tell me if i understand my settings correctly ? (see screenshot)
Info: NA engine, IAC valve, no throttle kicker
- ALS is allways ON
- ALS is ON for 5sec
- no EGT threshold (n/a)
- TPS >90% enables ALS
- TPS <2% starts ALS (for 5sec. see above)
- IAC opens max. while ALS
- No additional fuel enrichment during ALS
--> is normal fuelcut deactivated as long as ALS is active, even when this is 0%?
- 40° retard absolute during ALS
- max retard @2% TPS and 2.000rpm, min retard @90% / 6.000rpm
- no addtional spark cutting
--> what´s the add-on -> amplify the effect ?
--> should i use retard AND / OR spark cut ?
--> any other suggestions ?

(http://www.vems.hu/files/MembersPage/MacB/Pics/screens/200119_ALS.jpg)
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: gunni on January 20, 2020, 01:53:42 pm: You need to keep the ALS tight, otherwise according to your settings it would be on basically all the time.

Reactivation 5%
max retard at 2% TPS and min at 4% TPS, this means only below 4% will there be anything happening and only below 2% will it all be happening.
ALS retard at 2000rpm and 2100rpm, this means above 2100rpm you´ll have the full effect. It´ll turn off below 2000rpm

I´d try about -20° absolute as a start, otherwise there is a chance you might not be able to fire the mixture at all.

Try it

Also what is add-on?
Do some logs and put them up in the vemstune sharing center .
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: Mac-B on January 20, 2020, 05:58:48 pm: According to this:
http://www.vems.hu/wiki/index.php?page=MembersPage%2FGaborRacz%2FNewAlsLaunchAndOthers

and more precisely this chart:
http://www.vems.hu/files/Manual/Images/als.png

i was expecting the behaviour i described above..... only active after big throttle input and
as i limited the time to 5s it should be safe ?
i´ll use less retard the link above suggests " The highest ignition advance value plus 5-10", imho relative --> i´ll start with 10° absolute (ATDC)

the biggest open question is the behaviour of the "Maximum fuel enrichment". If zero --> no fuel in ALS OR full VE value and no add-on value ?

I´ll try it out, my hope was that somebody can explain me in theory first what the values mean, the F1 help is not self-explaining on that feature.
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: gunni on January 21, 2020, 07:41:21 am: Just try it and report back.
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: davide on December 30, 2020, 06:19:01 pm: Hi all,
after 5 years work I just completed building my Audi rally quattro replica gr B, engine is 5cyl turbo 20v managed by Vems V3.3 version 1.2.31 tuned in Germany together with the engine.
Exaust system is totally open and I would like to get some bangs and flames same as works cars did in the past.
I am not looking for winning the world championship, only enjoy driving my car, so I don't want an hard anti lag as the risk to kill my engine is quite high.
I got a look on the related topics, there are some valid suggestions about a soft anti lag always on but no one posted a feedback concerening what happened on the car.
Is it possible to get a parameter setting and some comments about that ?
Thank you very much from Italy
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: gunni on February 01, 2021, 08:24:21 am: Hello.
You would be best to have a antilag swich, the tuning then is done to only provide pops and bangs and not actually attempt any crazy ALS action.
You´ll have to contact a vems tuner and get him to help you as its very car specific what the settings have to be.
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: davide on February 01, 2021, 07:59:36 pm: Hi, Gunny tks for your message,
I am not able to find in Italy any Vems tuner as Vems here is not very popular.
I am thinking to follow your suggestion and provide my ECU for switching als on and off using an input with pullup channel.
Could you please post an als parameter setting just to get more or less what you mean ?
One more question : Als page in Vemstune has a throttle kicker actuating feature. Could I connect my als idle solenoid to this output using a free injector channel ? Is it needed a relè or it could be connected directly to gnd pin of the solenoid ?
Thank you very much for your help,
best regards,
Davide
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: MWfire on February 02, 2021, 07:49:40 pm: Are you near Zagreb(Croatia)?
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: gunni on February 09, 2021, 05:03:46 pm: Quote from: davide on February 01, 2021, 07:59:36 pm
Hi, Gunny tks for your message,
I am not able to find in Italy any Vems tuner as Vems here is not very popular.
I am thinking to follow your suggestion and provide my ECU for switching als on and off using an input with pullup channel.
Could you please post an als parameter setting just to get more or less what you mean ?
One more question : Als page in Vemstune has a throttle kicker actuating feature. Could I connect my als idle solenoid to this output using a free injector channel ? Is it needed a relè or it could be connected directly to gnd pin of the solenoid ?
Thank you very much for your help,
best regards,
Davide

I can´t post any settings as they all have to be set per vehicle
the throttle kicker you can wire to a 2 wire IAC and force it open when ALS is active. You can also force your current IAC to fully open with the settings in the menu.
You can use a free IGBT or Inj output to drive an IAC
Title: Re: I want fire and flames rev. limit
Post by: davide on March 01, 2021, 05:51:43 pm: Hi Gunny,
thank you so much for your replay and sorry for late answer.
I am living in Verona but we can't move due to Covid19 restrictions so we try to do what it is possible by messages.
I connected the idle valve as you suggested, now I am going to set inputs.
Last year I had a fail with V3.8 serial number 11010 order id 11521.
The ECU was sent to VEMS for repair and I got back a V3.8 serial number 19888 free of charge.
I haven' t received any EC18 pinout sheet .
I need to switch to GND n° 4 analog in chX provided with pullup, for ALS, MAP Switch, shift cut and launch control actuation.
How is it possible to know if my board is equipped with standard analog in ch 2-5-6-7 pullup config?
Thank you very much,
Davide