I've just been looking at this
http://www.vems.hu/wiki/index.php?page=TractionControlArm
:o :o
When I heard about a VEMS traction control, I assumed it would be just that - a traction control box using differential wheel speed an nothing more.
But whats being talked about here is the basis for a full stability control system. With 4 wheel speeds, 3 axis g sensors, steering and braking inputs and ABS solenoid outputs, plus a CAN link to the EMS to request reduced torque, this could be a really good piece of kit!
Whats the latest news on this Rob - are they going to actualy make it with the features for full stability control? When? How much? I want one !!!!!
Quite excited about this..... ;D
im also very intrested in this, how far from a working unit is this
The man who knows is David dnb: he's the man with the plan.
I think I started a bit of a monster with this... As far as I know (I've not done anything on VEMS since xmas) the TCS is still in the algorithm and concept stage, certainly not much further.
My prototype is my TVR with Ford triggers fitted to the hubs (they're Ford parts anyway) and whatever accelerometers I have laying around. Currently a 1D unit from my Impreza ABS. The Genboard doesn't have the necessary inputs for a proper go at TCS, hence the talk of a separate module and CAN bus etc...
My belief is that you can actually do a fair amount with just wheel sensors and a couple of interesting curve fitting algorithms, but once you involve the additional inputs like steering angle and acceleration, you have more states in your state space to play with, so you can make less assumptions...
Just like the radar stuff I play with 9 to 5...
any news about VEMS traction control arm? Is it in progress or postponed? Any dates?
Will it work with GenBoard v3.3?
VEMS fan
It'll work with 3.3 via the launch control input. ie triggering the rev limiter when TCS action is required.
Other than that, nothing to report - too many radar problems taking my time. :(
Do you think traction control arm will be ready fo market 2008 or later?
I think that even if the software and hardware was in place that tuning the system would be impossibly difficult.
Not impossible. Merely "quite difficult" ;)
TBH, there's not going to be that many tuning options - probably just an amout of slip before TCS involvement, plus config for sensors etc.
Tatech,Motec,Autronic have traction control for years already. VEMS should also have one.
Still whats you prediction is it coming out 2008 or later?
While I agree that TC would be nice to have I'm not in the business of making predictions as to when products will be ready for market.
Unfortunately no one from the Dev team uses the forum unless I specifically direct a tightly scoped question to them, so your requests will not been seen by those who'd be developing the product :( The best way is to use the Wiki for that, although I wouldn't be too hopeful of a response.
Quote from: dnb on January 27, 2007, 01:00:13 AM
I think I started a bit of a monster with this... As far as I know (I've not done anything on VEMS since xmas) the TCS is still in the algorithm and concept stage, certainly not much further.
Can I be a part of your development team, pleaaaaaaaaaaaaase? ;D
I have designed the PCB for a simple TC (only counting wheels speed), need to write some software for it, and wonder how would I present this information to the VEMS so it would lower the boost. PCB is based on ATmega128...
(http://slike.hr/slika/tcm0th.gif) (http://slike.hr/vidi/tcm0.gif)
BTW, PCB is 4x20 LCD size and matches up it pins. So Idea was to put the LCD also on TC, so it would calculate and display all the information like 0-60-100 time, 0-1/4-1/2 mile time, etc, fuel consumption, trip times, etc...
You'd need to talk to someone like Sambas about this.
Personally I'd keep your project your own, and discuss the interface between the two systems.
OK. Interface would be just fine if they provide me some information about it. I haven't found anything about it in wiki...
There is no interface, you'd need to negotiate the interface contract with them... Don't hold out much hope though - theres not that many options for inputs anymore :(
You could connect a 0-5v output from your controller to the VEMS´s analog input and then connect that as a boost lowering device.
I could use SPI, I2C, UART... If not, would use launch control input...
Or that boost analog input...
It's not to much problem, after I utilize the TC itself. Hell, I could control wastegate directly if everything else fails... ;)
I have been looking at using the CAN enabled AVR chip for a couple of new projects. I wonder if something along those lines is an option?
CAN would be my first choice because it's a well established standard, but RS232 to pass data into the VEMS probably wouldn't be all that bad.
Unfortunately I have zero time for "home" developments at the moment, and it's not looking like changing until September when I might find myself with far too much time ;)
Are you saying that I could put AT90CAN128 on Vems 3.3 board and it would work? Isn't the canbus subroutine too demanding for the VEMS?
And ofcourse AT90CAN128 is about 5 times more expansive then ATmega128
I'm not sure a CAN128 would work directly in a V3.3, but it would be really good if it did! I could envisage a daughterboard style device which holds the CAN128, feeds the standard I/O back to the VEMS and has access to the CAN bits. You would need the support of the VEMS software people and that's not easy so maybe it's not such a good idea after all... :( CAN would be really nice for some things I have been experimenting with - "simple" standard interface involving no new wires!
Not sure what you mean by "too demanding for the VEMS"? In terms of software or hardware? (I very much doubt you could implement a software CAN bus on a VEMS.)
Out of interest, how easy would it be to get a few (say 5 to 10) circuit boards made? They're PTH double sided. The snag is that I hand drew the artwork in a general CAD tool - I don't trust autorouters anyway - and made the prototype in the old fashioned way... I can't find a way of converting to a proper circuit board format :( I've been out of the electronics game for too long!
Quote from: dnb on June 06, 2009, 06:17:04 PM
I'm not sure a CAN128 would work directly in a V3.3, but it would be really good if it did! I could envisage a daughterboard style device which holds the CAN128, feeds the standard I/O back to the VEMS and has access to the CAN bits. You would need the support of the VEMS software people and that's not easy so maybe it's not such a good idea after all... :( CAN would be really nice for some things I have been experimenting with - "simple" standard interface involving no new wires!
Daughter CAN board insn't problem, but we still have problem with interfacing daughter board to the VEMS?! SPI porheps? My TC board is acting like daughter board for VEMS, but I still dont' have a clue what interface to use, and there is no protocol set for such device like TC...
Quote
Not sure what you mean by "too demanding for the VEMS"? In terms of software or hardware? (I very much doubt you could implement a software CAN bus on a VEMS.)
AT90CAN128 can be soldered on VEMS 3.x, it would fit, it has the same pinout as ATmega128, but I think software subroutines for CAN comunication is too much for VEMS firmware as ATmega128 is on it's limit with timing and flash space...
Quote
Out of interest, how easy would it be to get a few (say 5 to 10) circuit boards made? They're PTH double sided. The snag is that I hand drew the artwork in a general CAD tool - I don't trust autorouters anyway - and made the prototype in the old fashioned way... I can't find a way of converting to a proper circuit board format :( I've been out of the electronics game for too long!
Are you talking about my TC PCB? It's not a problem... I have done 10pcs already, and another 10 is not a problem... I have designed it manually in protel but still didn't test it....
No, I was talking about getting a different board made - it's to control the heater and aircon on my TVR. I could do with having a couple of spares for demos and eventual sale and don't fancy manually aligning the artwork again... I could use some advice as to how best to get them made from my drawings - It could do with being a separate thread I suppose.
Yes I suppose...
I think if I can convert a set of DXF files into a Gerber (or similar) then I can get the boards made by anyone I like for not much money. However I can't find anything to do that.
I'm using protel, and the local PCB guy have no problem with it...