Hi, im new here, first time for me to work with vems!
I instal the v3.6 to run my h6 ez30r avcs+vvl
I didn't wire up the avcs I just want to start the car at first
I want some advice about my log
look like i dont have spark event, but not sure what mean ignition falling
The car crank but dont start, all my coil have 12v,gnd,signal
I use the config file from kamuto here who did the same swap
Here'S my trigger log and the config file
http://vems.hu/vemstune/sharingcenter/reports.php?cmd=view&key=jllvbp
thanks
Hello Shark_22,
I have reviewed you triggerlog, you have spark events (called IGN_FALLING) and they seem to happen a bit before TDC. So from triggering side all looks good.
Did you verify ignition order and timing with a timing light to check your ignition outputs setup ?
Best regards, Dave
Thanks for your answer,I didnt use the timming light yet
As pimary; crank sensor vr
secondary; RH cam hall
Third; LH cam hall
But i read in the Gintsk post that we have to put the Lh cam on secondary (on my h6 avcs), so I try today
I got my log + config file here
http://vems.hu/vemstune/sharingcenter/reports.php?cmd=view&key=3OerLY
Not sure what happen
The car crank, I hear the compression but dont start
so I chek my ignition coil and I dont have spark..
coil on plug, got my 12v,gnd on each while cranking and have continuity on each signal to the econoseal
When I try to test my ignition coil noting happen..
If i do the same thing with my injector, I hear it cliking(also got fuel)
So I dont know whats wrong in my setup
For some information:
firing order: 1-6-3-2-5-4
Ignition CYL 1: PIN 34
Ignition CYL 2: PIN 36
Ignition CYL 3: PIN 11
Ignition CYL 4: PIN12
Ignition CYL 5: PIN35
Ignition CYL 6: PIN33
Injector CYL 1: PIN 7
Injector CYL 2: PIN 19
Injector CYL 3: PIN 8
Injector CYL 4: PIN 20
Injector CYL 5: PIN 9
Injector CYL 6: PIN 18
So if i understand i got spark(ignition falling) but in real my spark plug doesnt..
If somebody can check this out and find something wrong!
thanks
Lets take things one step at a time:
1) when the coil does not fire using the test mode in VemsTune->Base setup->Ignition Outputs Visual, there is no need to proceed with any cranking test what so ever. The reason for the test mode not working needs to be diagnosed first, most likely cause imho is either no power to the coil or wrong coil connection. Do not proceed to step 2 until this is fixed.
2) verify trigger connection; according to my notes for "Subaru 36-2-2-2 (H6) AVCS Camsync" the left cam sensor connects to the secondary trigger.
3) after changing the trigger wires, take another triggerlog @ cranking without INJ or IGN fuse 8-10 seconds and post it for review, if there a no trigger errors proceed to step 4.
4) when the coils are working in testing mode, verify engine timing and firing order with timing light at cranking only (removed INJ fuse, IGN only), correct firing order, trigger tooth and tdc after the trigger if needed.
5) reinsert INJ fuse, try cranking the engine; If fueling is somewhat in the ballpark it should start.
Best regards, Dave
If you can go check in the ignition output table, you gonna se where i put it.
Subaru coil have 3 wire
12v,gnd,signal
I goy my 12v,gnd, but No signal
I got continuity on each signal wire on each coil to the econoseal..
The v3 supply a 5v in the ignition output(signal)?
If yes I got nothing and i dont see where im wrong..
thanks
Hello Shark_22,
Following my analogy of the step by step approach, it seems you are at step 1) and found out your Subaru most likely has active coils instead of passive ( 'dumb') coils ?
Did you order your Vems system with options matching this ? If so, wire the coils to Ignition outputs which are marked logic out on the information sheet that came with your ecu and try again.
Best regards, Dave
Hi
For a 4 cyl. we sometimes make a pull up to the fets and invert the outputs in software.
I think you maybe need a stronger signal to trig the coils. They normally work using the stepper.
Logiclevel will not trig this kind of coil.
peter
works no problem with logic level :)
Good day Gentlemen! I am helping Shark 22 with this. We contacted Jason via FB and he mentioned to use steppers ABC. Thanks Jason for your replies. We wired cyl 1&2 to A, 5&6 to B, C to 3&4. We got spark finally. I do understand this is the wasted spark method as any H4 atmo engine.
Now, this is the weird part. We turn engine over and we got some afterfire! I have swaped heads on one of my Subarus in the past and I had the wrong trigger cam. I had the same type of symptoms.
So, I do believe there is a timing issue going on. Getting after fire and starter strains showing firing before piston gets to TDC!
Also, the ECU he ordered has IGBT's when he shouldn't have. He specified clearly that they were active or smart coils since the ignitors are incorperated into the coils. This in return is probably another setback that is confusing us in this set-up. Meaning we are wiring properly, but the ecu isn't set-up for this configuration.
Cheers,
Gary
Quote from: Gary UrS4 on September 02, 2014, 10:43:46 PM
Good day Gentlemen! I am helping Shark 22 with this. We contacted Jason via FB and he mentioned to use steppers ABC. Thanks Jason for your replies. We wired cyl 1&2 to A, 5&6 to B, C to 3&4. We got spark finally. I do understand this is the wasted spark method as any H4 atmo engine.
Now, this is the weird part. We turn engine over and we got some afterfire! I have swaped heads on one of my Subarus in the past and I had the wrong trigger cam. I had the same type of symptoms.
So, I do believe there is a timing issue going on. Getting after fire and starter strains showing firing before piston gets to TDC!
Also, the ECU he ordered has IGBT's when he shouldn't have. He specified clearly that they were active or smart coils since the ignitors are incorperated into the coils. This in return is probably another setback that is confusing us in this set-up. Meaning we are wiring properly, but the ecu isn't set-up for this configuration.
Cheers,
Gary
don't think he mentioned that coils are smart, he just mentioned that coils have 3 wires, and as most bmw, and audi 3 wire coils these are dumb ones. if you are having timing issue, just check timing with timing light..
Why with a timing light? We have trigger logs and triggers on cams etc. Using a timing light on an old v-8 with distributor cap I understand, but with a car with senors? Timing wheel and cam wheels are OEM and haven't been changed. Something is set up different in the software.
Quote from: Kamuto on September 03, 2014, 03:55:53 AM
Quote from: Gary UrS4 on September 02, 2014, 10:43:46 PM
Good day Gentlemen! I am helping Shark 22 with this. We contacted Jason via FB and he mentioned to use steppers ABC. Thanks Jason for your replies. We wired cyl 1&2 to A, 5&6 to B, C to 3&4. We got spark finally. I do understand this is the wasted spark method as any H4 atmo engine.
Now, this is the weird part. We turn engine over and we got some afterfire! I have swaped heads on one of my Subarus in the past and I had the wrong trigger cam. I had the same type of symptoms.
So, I do believe there is a timing issue going on. Getting after fire and starter strains showing firing before piston gets to TDC!
Also, the ECU he ordered has IGBT's when he shouldn't have. He specified clearly that they were active or smart coils since the ignitors are incorperated into the coils. This in return is probably another setback that is confusing us in this set-up. Meaning we are wiring properly, but the ecu isn't set-up for this configuration.
Cheers,
Gary
don't think he mentioned that coils are smart, he just mentioned that coils have 3 wires, and as most bmw, and audi 3 wire coils these are dumb ones. if you are having timing issue, just check timing with timing light..
all Subaru coil on plug with 3 wire are smart coil..
anyway, this is not a problem now I got spark, I need to get it start!
I gonna send my config log and trigger log soon if somebody can see something wrong!
my config,log
http://vems.hu/vemstune/sharingcenter/reports.php?cmd=view&key=I9kv1t
For people who have install a vems in a ez30 or any Subaru with 32-2-2-2 are using the original crank Wheel?
Just once, use fuckin timing light, this is not p&p ecu,
Thanks for the constructive answer! We will be using a fucking timing light shortly! ::)
Quote from: Gary UrS4 on September 06, 2014, 11:48:08 AM
Thanks for the constructive answer! We will be using a fucking timing light shortly! ::)
:D
so we use the timing light and finally set the cyl 1 to tdc
the firing order is good using the steper
The car crank but dont start
I have put the tdc after trigger to 53deg like in the h6 avcs config and put 0 degree to crancking ignition advance
I want to know if somebody can check the triger log and config file i got..
http://vems.hu/vemstune/sharingcenter/reports.php?cmd=view&key=5Uc5MR
want to confirm too if the rh cam is secondary or third(and tell me if you tell me the side from the front of the car or in the car)
the secondary triger is falling or rising?
thanks
Ok all! This car previously had an EG33 from a 1994 SVX that was done by me mechanically and the wiring by me from OBDI to OBDII chassis with OEM ecu. Thing ran awesome.
Also, my other project was swapping in a 150PD diesel engine from europe into a 2004 A4 Avant 1.8T. I also did the electrical and mechanical work on this car. This car was chipped and I had to fabricate everything for the bigger turbo etc. Also the wiring from a VW BORA OEM diesel ecu to Audi A4 Avant 1.8T wiring. So, this is just a heads up that I am not a rookie. Just stumped about this whole situation.
All set at 0deg in Vems tune. Wasted spark using steppers. I made an aluminium plate in my lathe and glued on a 360 deg wheel printed on paper. Also, I wanted to know at what degree it was firing and this was very helpful.
Timing wheel!
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t35.0-12/10648411_592954550827085_5265370256528852776_o.jpg?oh=71b734bc316e711f201e9704df0235ba&oe=5410D07C&__gda__=1410386090_8b9d4317148d0791ac6d23782ea9a37f)
Ok, so we timed the engine. Steppers aren't where they should be. 1&2 were firing 0deg, 3&4 at 120 deg and 5&6 at 240 deg. So steppers are NOT at the right place on the circuit board or there is a conflict between software/hardware. I swapped 5&6 with 3&4.
So, I swapped Steppers b & C. Still no start. I then used brake cleaner! Engine fired right up, so timing is good for coils. Now the fun part. When we test injectors, 1 to 6 are at the right place when we test. While cranking we have 12V for the injectors. Injectors DO NOT click during cranking! Any parameters we are missing? We are using the 36-2-2-2 with AVCS for the H6.
Thanks
can you supply log of cranking?
http://vems.hu/vemstune/sharingcenter/reports.php?cmd=view&key=emewX7
http://vems.hu/vemstune/sharingcenter/reports.php?cmd=view&key=PJgl5o
not sure is this my linux laptop or it's yours fuel table completely wrong + map sensor calibration is totaly wrong too :) it must show 100kpa when engine is not running :)
(http://s23.postimg.org/86lfs2ohz/Screenshot_from_2014_09_11_02_20_20.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/86lfs2ohz/)
ok good, im gonna check my map setting tomorrow!
For the cam trigger, the car have start with the lh cam as secondary and rh cam as sedondary, so which one is the good one and just to be sure, you tell the side from the front of the car, or sit in the car?
thanks
well, i change my map value,still dont start but i got 100kpa when not start..
http://vems.hu/vemstune/sharingcenter/reports.php?cmd=view&key=H7znHv
i got my map connection after the throttle if it change something
like in alpha n menu, we can choose before or after throttle..
if it works with carb cleaner and does not start on petrol that means you dont get fuel, search for fuel, not for the map hose place..
I have some new ve and injector value(thanks to jason)
Now the car start by his own(kind of)
I didnt wired up my iac yet, so when i crank we can hear that the car want to start, so i give some throttle and than the engine start but stall right after and smell the fuel,alot of smoke from the exhaust, look like i go too much fuel and the engine cant fire like normal
here a video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qwK1ole2Ec&feature=youtu.be
crank log
http://vems.hu/vemstune/bugreports/reports.php?cmd=view&key=lcPmF7
thanks
Add more fuel, ve table is wrong.
Also afterstart fuel and warump.
well, I remove my iac from throttle body and the car can start a hold a kind of idle(very rough) and finnaly stop
Smell the fuel and black smoke from the exhaust...for me its too rich.
But I dont know what modify in my table(never tune a computer..), if somebody can take a look and modify my tables would be very nice..Or if somebody got a base map that i can adapt to my car or where i can see where my tables are wrong!
here's my config and crank log
http://vems.hu/vemstune/sharingcenter/reports.php?cmd=view&key=m4UbZ2
thanks
Like shark22 says. He removed IAC from throttle body. Car would start and die. This time it idled a bit rough and was smoking like a freight train. Like he said, I believe car is running too rich. Without IAC it should rev easily to 2500-3000rpm. It just idles with a lope at around 1000rpm.
He is getting somewhere, but i do believe fuel mapping is off. To all helping. Thanks, it's greatly appreciated.
There are a lot of issues/errors in that config file - the logs shows ungodly amounts of fuel being injected as well so it's not a surprise that it will not start or when it runs it shoots out white smoke.
Try this file.. you might have to play with the VE table go get in the right area as that is not something I can do for you. But if your req_fuel is somewhat correct, you should be able to get it at least running with not too many changes.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/56237915/Subaru-test-mod-rev0.vemscfg
thanks to NOTORIOUS VR for the modification, the engine run much better!
I got some other question..
I wired up my avcs and vvl but got something strange with it
ez30r got 2 solenoid for the avcs and 2 solenoid for vvl
-For the avcs, I connect both 12v together and the 2 signal together to one injector output
-For the vvl, I connect both 12v together and the 2 signal together to one injector output
Now the funny part
If both avcs connector are disconected, I got my 12v and got the ground control from the ecu working, But If i connect one connector to the solenoid and I check on the other connector, I got 12v on each pin, I use the test light when this happen and I got 12v + gnd from ecu in the same wire..impossible.same thing with vvl
So do I need a diode or something is wrong how we wired it?
thanks
You just need some brains, thats all :) both avcs solenoids need to be connecte to different outputs :)
Quote from: Kamuto on October 15, 2014, 10:41:33 AM
You just need some brains, thats all :) both avcs solenoids need to be connecte to different outputs :)
haha, If your not able to answer me respecfully just dont answer me and go play with your thing :)
Did you get this running right with the oe trigger setup ?
And running the avcs also ?
I would like to use one in a impreza including the electronic throttle
yes, I got it running with the default trigger setup, I also need to put the tdc after trig around 70degree, Lh as secondary trigger.
I got the avcs-vvl working but I disable it the time I got a complete tune next year!
You want to swap an ez30r in a impreza? Vems can support dbw now?
DBW works great.
dbw test on tfsi engine. PPS is pedal position sensor.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lVaaKms4A0